JH: Travelling to Hamburg to talk about the social background of the 'men's movement' in Britain, I didn't really know what to expect. I even didn't know that Richard and I had travelled together on the same plane until after we'd arrived on the Thursday lunchtime.
RS: Presenting a seminar on the 'Men's Movement' in Britain as part of a recognised University course option was for me a rather strange and seemingly academic experience. To do so in the English and Cultural Studies department of Hamburg University was stranger still. Hans Peter Lutjen, a lecturer and organiser of a Men against Men's Violence group in the city of Hamburg had set up the seminar for this April which was to cover 'The language and sociological aspects of the Men's Movement in Great Britain and the United States'. I was not at all sure what this meant, but since I'd been asked to read and talk about my poetry I decided to turn up and do just that.
JH: The first session we were to do was from six to nine on the Thursday evening. It was publicly advertised as being both poetry reading and a talk on Men Against Sexism and Men/Women Relations in Britain. In order to be of use to different types of possible audience, I brought with me more information, handouts etc. than necessary.
RS: Jeff, who I'd not met before, and myself worked together to prepare the first session. We presented an unusual blend of 'lecturing', readings and discussion. After briefly introducing ourselves we asked all the students to form small groups and spend a few minutes each talking about why they had come and what they were hoping to get out of the session, the others in the group listening without interruption. Everyone seemed more at ease after the exercise, alert and lively. Jeff then gave a general background to the development of men against sexism groups in this country, linking this in with recent political events such as the miner's strike and the abolition of the GLC. Women had been in many cases a powerful physical presence on the picket lines and against a background of threat to a traditionally masculine industry this provides a potent challenge to our views of Male and Female roles within society.
At this point I read some poems, particularly 'The Men are A River' which explores the image of men pouring out of factories, offices and pitheads, the terrible distance between us, our 'shame' of soft touching. Previously we'd been nervous about this approach but our doubts rapidly vanished and the blend of information, poetry and personal accounts seemed to stimulate a strong and intimate discussion between both the students and ourselves. It was important to us to use the seminar as an opportunity to raise questions around the effect of sexism on the lives of those taking part and how they might be able to challenge it, as well as to present factual information about the Men's Movement here.
JH: That first session was for me the realisation of a kind of fantasy I'd had in the past - summed up in the phrase, 'Mixed media'. The mixture of short talks, poems, pair work, and discussions seemed to be as natural as can be - why can't we have more meetings, committees, workshops that combine poetry, information-giving, argument, co-counselling, and so on? Why have we got to define each situation as separate?
The main weekend course was organised by the University of Hamburg for students and the Volkshochschule (Community High School or Further Education Centre) mainly for teachers of English, and ran from the Friday afternoon through Saturday and to Sunday. It was entitled 'The New Man and His Speech' ? the 'new man' appearing to be the German equivalent of 'anti-sexist', and without the Guardian?reading connotations. The course included Richard's poetry and video; a session on the men's movement in the United States; a showing of some of the Channel 4 'About Men' films; another session on how mainstream (malestream?) fiction writers had dealt with issues of sexual politics, including a detailed look at the revolting Stanley and the Women by Kingsley Amis; and my sessions on the development of men against sexism activities in Britain and the writing that had come out of them.
RS: Due to the enormous interest generated by the subject of 'The New Man', around sixty students attended the weekend and sessions had to be double up giving us two groups instead of one to work with and consequently half the time to present the same material. About two thirds of those attending were women, and although this echoes roughly the sex ratio of students within the languages department we were disappointed to see so few men.
My session was divided into two parts. Firstly I talked about the use of language and writing by anti-sexist men and read several poems from my booklet The Proof. Two poems were then discussed in small groups, 'The Men are a River' and 'Rites of Passage' which concerns men taking power over women. The ensuing debate was so lively that it was almost impossible to bring it to a conclusion and proceed to the second part. The second session involved showing a video I am currently making with some other men looking at how we communicate in men's groups and as friends. The very personal nature of the interviews provoked some men to approach me afterwards. It was too difficult to talk in such a large group, they said. Could you give us some more information? If we start a men's group how do we go about it?
Hopefully the course will proceed well and the issues raised during the weekend will perhaps be explored in more detail and acted upon. If men can be invited to make such a presentation in a German University surely there is even more scope for similar institutions in this country. This may take a little research, finding sympathetic teachers/lecturers who can open up a niche within their particular department, but let's be ready to consider talking to anyone, anywhere who will have us.
JH: During our stay we were also able to talk with Hans?Peter about the men's group against men's violence (Manner Gegen Manner-Gewalt) that he is involved with in Hamburg. The group has been going since about May 1984 and has been established with limited finance since November 1984, as a counselling/self-help group for men who are or have been violent or potentially violent. The group has advertised its existence through a poster campaign, and has a telephone answering machine to receive calls from those who respond to the advert. Weekly meetings are held, at which newcomers are given the time and opportunity to explain their situation/problem/experiences, with a view to clarifying the main areas and issues that need attention and counselling in the group. All counselling is done in the group, although sometimes the group splits into two if there are several newcomers at the meeting. Over a period of weeks and months men who originally came for their own counselling tend to move to become more in the role of counsellors - but throughout the issue of violence is a real one for all, not a distanced problem for others. The core members of the group number about twelve. During the year 1984?85, 103 telephone calls were received on the answering machine - these broke down as follows:
24 from the media Some further information on the group is given in a short article, 'Schneller Schlag' in Der Spiegel of 17th February 1986. However, perhaps the best way to convey what the group is about is to reproduce that part of the group's poster that defines men's violence to women:
15 from interested women
13 from women suffering men's violence
4 from children
14 from interested men
33from violent men, of whom 9 became group members.
Mannergewalt ist Frauen SCHLAGEN (beating women)
Mannergewalt ist Frauen ZWINGEN (forcing women)
Mannergewalt ist Frauen BEDROHEN (threatening women)
Mannergewalt ist Frauen ANGRIEFEN (attacking women)
Mannergewalt ist Frauen VERLETZEN (hurting women)
Mannergewalt ist Frauen QUALEN (tormenting women)
Mannergewalt ist Frauen MISSHANDLEN (ill-treating women)
Mannergewalt ist Frauen VERGEWALTIGEN (raping women)
MANN, UBST AUCH DU DIESE GEWALTAUS? (Man, do you also use this violence?)
RS. Whilst in Hamburg we also saw a rather remarkable film. 'Manner' (Men), a film by a woman director, Dorte Dorrie, which had been running at three cinemas four times a day for sixteen weeks. The film's subject is a woman's view of how one man reacts when his wife takes a lover. At first he is wildly jealous and violent, but then he handles the situation the only way he as a man feels able to cope. He teaches the lover to be exactly the same as himself; his wife then loses all interest in the man preferring to put up with the original rather than the copy. That this kind of film can draw such an audience without aid of explicit sex, violence or sexist imagery is worth thinking about.
JH: This account of the long weekend has itself been a kind of mixed media production - written in parts, a couple of hundred miles away, separately, but in collaboration. No account of the weekend would be complete without mention of the intimacy, love and friendship with Richard and Hans-Peter there. I feel more hopeful now.
Richard Sterne writes poems, makes videos, and lives in Ipswich.
Jeff Hearn lives in Bradford, where he teaches 'men and masculinity' and other courses at the University.
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